source file: mills3.txt Date: Mon, 22 Sep 1997 10:18:24 +0200 Subject: Re: pop in microtones From: "Jonathan M. Szanto" Wellllll, this was too delicious to let go... >Perhaps microtones is -- and has already been -- part and parcel of pop. >Without getting too specific at first about what _pop_ is, comtemplate the >following if you will. Since the whole thread revolved around *pop*, it doesn't seem relevant to avoid the issue of what pop is, but let that lie for a second. The big point was about microtonal pop as a mainstream phenomena. Most of Johnny's rationale *seems* to stem from microtonal inflections occurring in otherwise 12tet musics. I say seems, since his presentation is in generalities, not specifics. God is in the details... >Blues, heavy metal, rap, and much of music for commercials (unusual >music needed for quick sell). Oh yeah? Just when did Taylor/Fender/Other start mass-producing non12tet guitars? "much" of music for commercials? >Beach Boys and Pink Floyd are regularly in just intonation. Whitney >Houston and Albert King and Odetta and Louis Armstrong are regular >practitioners of microtones. Come on, Johnny, at least give examples! I could agree that the BB's choral harmonies were probably altered to be more in tune -- but what about the Farfiza/Vox/Other organs that they were playing (and gtrs, etc.)? Don't tell me Whitney has explicitly equipped her bands with Ensoniq gear, tuned to some slendro scale! That a vocal line, esp. in blues, gospel, or any other roots-derived style would carry with it microtonal nuances, melismas, figurations or ornaments: no argument -- that's where the expressivity comes in. Likewise, though I cracked about the gtrs, we all know they can bend pitch either with left hand pulls or with a tremelo/whammy bar (probably called a 'Floyd Rose' or something nowadays). But that is *on top of* a bedrock of undeniable, and immovable, 12tet underpinnings. Thank goodness for doo-wop (I am not a BBshop 4tet fan, though your mileage may vary...) [is it 'tremelo' or 'tremello' or ?] >Globalization of world music brings in the microtonal musics of Bulgaria, >Egypt, India, Indonesia, et al. Sure does, and I love it. Notice how much it changed Michael Bolton, Kenny G. and Aerosmith? Not to mention the Spice Girls... >The pedigree of Charles Ives for theory, intentioin, and compositions >leads to microtone useage by composers Aaron Copland, Bela Bartok, Pierre >Boulez, Gyorgy Liggeti, Krzysztof Penderecki, et al. Well, *whatever* your definition, these boys (yep, all male) aren't pop. That's for damn sure. Aaron Copland, microtonalist? Wow. That's like saying "Harry Partch, champion body-surfer"! >International pioneering by Partch, Wyschnegradsky, Haba, Fokker, >Carrillo, et al. lead to new generations of micros, that beget even more >recent generations. >Right now in New York, microtones are mainstream. We are talking about the occurring sounds emanating from the squeals of taxi brakes, no? (Wait, they use their horns, not their brakes...). Being an out-of-towner, I can only keep up by reading the concert schedule in the "New Yorker", and the occaisional Village Voice. Nope -- looks like pretty much the old guard is still in charge. Please let us know (other than the AFMM festival and the odd Newband concerts) what constitutes "mainstream". >Within the last 10 years there has been a lead microtonalist at each >newspaper and radio station in the city. In NYC, that must be dozens of radio stations, and a large handful of papers; all of these have successful and established microtonal composers/performers on staff? >Denver, Boston, San Diego, San Francisco, Los Angeles, and other cities >provide microtonal institutions. I will speak only to the middle one: hogwash. There is no microtonal institution here in San Diego, at least one that has *any* consequence on the populace of the locality, much less a wider influence. If you mean the Interval Foundation (if that is the name of Jonathan Glasier's group/coalition), then I respectfully report that it is in name only: I have seen just one concert, quite a few months back, there is no 'institution', and the quality of the music-making is not sufficiently breath-taking. Although maybe Johnny meant that John Chalmers was an institution! :) >Time to stopping looking into the books and smell the coffee. Microtones >are here to stay. :) Boy, I thought the Nu Yawk coffee was stronger than that. Look, I'm happy to see enthusiasm for any niche item, because through that infectious verve people will be, if not converted, pleased, enlightened and (dare I say it) entertained. Boosterism doesn't do anyone any good when it is completely at odds with reality. Neil has the right idea: write good (ooops, 'killer') music, play it well, record and distribute it methodically and it will spread -- slowly. Then again, I was the one that predicted the long curve. But pop, both microtonal *and* widespread? Anybody here into holding their breath?? Cheers, Jon ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Jonathan M. Szanto | Corporeal Meadows: Harry Partch, online. . . jszanto@adnc.com | http://www.adnc.com/web/jszanto/welcome.html SMTPOriginator: tuning@eartha.mills.edu From: reinhard@IDT.NET Subject: Re: pop in microtones PostedDate: 22-09-97 17:54:28 SendTo: CN=coul1358/OU=AT/O=EZH ReplyTo: tuning@eartha.mills.edu $UpdatedBy: CN=notesrv2/OU=Server/O=EZH,CN=coul1358/OU=AT/O=EZH,CN=Manuel op de Coul/OU=AT/O=EZH RouteServers: CN=notesrv2/OU=Server/O=EZH,CN=notesrv1/OU=Server/O=EZH RouteTimes: 22-09-97 17:54:17-22-09-97 17:54:17,22-09-97 17:53:24-22-09-97 17:53:25 DeliveredDate: 22-09-97 17:53:25 Categories: $Revisions: Received: from ns.ezh.nl by notesrv2.ezh.nl (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.1 (385.6 5-6-1997)) with SMTP id C125651A.00575A92; Mon, 22 Sep 1997 17:54:08 +0200 Received: by ns.ezh.nl; (5.65v3.2/1.3/10May95) id AA04337; Mon, 22 Sep 1997 17:54:28 +0200 Date: Mon, 22 Sep 1997 17:54:28 +0200 Received: from ella.mills.edu by ns (smtpxd); id XA04357 Received: (qmail 10438 invoked from network); 22 Sep 1997 15:54:21 -0000 Received: from localhost (HELO ella.mills.edu) (127.0.0.1) by localhost with SMTP; 22 Sep 1997 15:54:21 -0000 Message-Id: Errors-To: madole@mills.edu Reply-To: tuning@eartha.mills.edu Originator: tuning@eartha.mills.edu Sender: tuning@eartha.mills.edu