source file: mills3.txt Date: Wed, 10 Dec 1997 22:24:56 +0100 Subject: Re: Greg's comments From: John Starrett Hi gang- Greg makes some strong pronouncements, and I disagree more than I agree. Last night I programmed Cakewalk to play this melody (a step line to line is 10 cents, and the chart is to be read left to right, piano roll style) - - - - - -- - - -- - - - - -- - - - - - - - - - - - -- - - The difference in each four note phrase was easily heard. Here is a melody interleaved with several variations in which each difference of 10 cents is obvious. A couple of points I argue against-- >1.Musicians do not write for exceptionally acute listeners, but for the >masses. I certainly don't write for the masses. Others may, but it strikes me as a huge waste of time. >2. 22-tone equal involves its failure to close the >cycle of fifths. I am aware that some will say to themselves - so what? "So what?", I said to myself. You were right about that. >3. But a musical system that does not close the cycle of fifths has at a >stroke isolated itself from 99% of the music not merely of the western >19th century, but from virtually the whole of the western tradition, and >from many other musical traditions as well. And...? >4. The septimal limit is more interesting. But it is dissonant... Dissonant? Even the 7/4? >5. Your reference to individuals being trained to reliably distinguish >melodic intervals as close as 10 cents is the most fantastic piece of >information I have ever been privileged to encounter. There is nothing fantastic about this. In a laboratory setting this sort of resolution is not extraordinary (try the above tablature experiment yourself). Training is the key. Now, to recognize a 10 cent difference in a live performance without training, of course you are right. Remember, the people on this list are not Joe Average, and they are trained (or train themselves) to make these sorts of distinctions. Greg, keep it up. I love the controversy you generate. John Starrett SMTPOriginator: tuning@eartha.mills.edu From: "Paul H. Erlich" Subject: RE: repeating patterns PostedDate: 10-12-97 23:04:34 SendTo: CN=coul1358/OU=AT/O=EZH ReplyTo: tuning@eartha.mills.edu $MessageStorage: 0 $UpdatedBy: CN=notesrv2/OU=Server/O=EZH,CN=coul1358/OU=AT/O=EZH,CN=Manuel op de Coul/OU=AT/O=EZH RouteServers: CN=notesrv2/OU=Server/O=EZH,CN=notesrv1/OU=Server/O=EZH RouteTimes: 10-12-97 23:02:44-10-12-97 23:02:45,10-12-97 23:02:31-10-12-97 23:02:32 DeliveredDate: 10-12-97 23:02:32 Categories: $Revisions: Received: from ns.ezh.nl ([137.174.112.59]) by notesrv2.ezh.nl (Lotus SMTP MTA SMTP v4.6 (462.2 9-3-1997)) with SMTP id C1256569.0079159A; Wed, 10 Dec 1997 23:04:30 +0100 Received: by ns.ezh.nl; (5.65v3.2/1.3/10May95) id AA12002; Wed, 10 Dec 1997 23:04:34 +0100 Date: Wed, 10 Dec 1997 23:04:34 +0100 Received: from ella.mills.edu by ns (smtpxd); id XA11999 Received: (qmail 4809 invoked from network); 10 Dec 1997 14:04:30 -0800 Received: from localhost (HELO ella.mills.edu) (127.0.0.1) by localhost with SMTP; 10 Dec 1997 14:04:30 -0800 Message-Id: Errors-To: madole@mills.edu Reply-To: tuning@eartha.mills.edu Originator: tuning@eartha.mills.edu Sender: tuning@eartha.mills.edu