source file: m1539.txt Date: Tue, 29 Sep 1998 16:23:43 -0400 Subject: Neutral third, 11/9, blues From: "Paul H. Erlich" Johnny Reinhard wrote, >> >One special characteristic of the neutral third is that no matter what >> >kind of 5th there is in a system, the neutral third is always in the same >> >place logarithmically. > David Finnamore wrote, >> Do you mean that neutral thirds have the same relationship to the tonic >> regardless of how the 5th is tuned, or that the pitch of the 3rd rises and >> falls in logarithmic proportion to the height of the 5th, or...? Johnny Reinhard wrote, >While the thirds accordian proportionately to the fifth (however large is >one third, the other is condensed), the neutral third is always dead >center, dividing the fifth into 2 identical parts. Just as the tritone >bisects the octave, the neutral third bisects the perfect fifth. >The neutral thirds of all the meantones, 12-TET, 31-TET, quartertones, >Egyptian music, and others are roughly all in the same place because the >fifth is so etched in its shape. The difference of a few cents in either >direction from 351 cents (at perfect fifth of 702 cents) is negligible for >musical purposes. Though I'm not sure what the neutral third of 12-TET is, I basically agree. However, there are tuning systems where the neutral third is not dead center, such as Partch's, where an 11/9 (347 cents) is the neutral third. But I think that musical uses of the neutral third tend to derive from a logarithmic bisection of the perfect fifth, and not the 11/9 ratio. In blues, the neutral third is very common, as is the neutral seventh, which is a perfect fifth higher and acts as a sort of leading tone. I think I might know something about the blues because I got a great response from the audience at a recent gig at Buddy Guy's Legends. The 7/6 or some sort of sub-minor third does occur with some frequency, though, and I at least hear some consonance when it falls over the IV chord (so I use it there a lot). The 7/4 is least common of these but I hear it used by gospel singers and harmonica players over the I and in passing by guitarists bending up from the 6th to the flat 7th.